The original post of this was a letter I wrote to the Canberra Times. The Canberra Times have their own forum, where my comments have provoked a fair bit of discussion too. I will now provide for you some of the interesting responses: (Note: the first post by Argus Tuft I originally put up here under his name but forgot to delete his refernces to my real name, which I have now replaced with XXXX).

Dear XXXX - "We look down with shame upon our national capital", XXXX, Monday, 26 July 2004 - You don't have a single clue do you?
If you think really hard - try closing your eyes and strain really hard - you just might manage to get that second neurone of yours to synapse and then you would have enough brain power to search the web and get some information - try http://www.kangaroo-industry.asn.au/industry.html for starters.

If the Kangaroo population was allowed to go on breeding unchecked this country would be a wasteland in the next decade. Millions - Yes! "MILLIONS" - of kangaroos are leagally slaughtered every year!

Now - stick you head back in the sand!

Redneck ACT at Googong rued by many(225 words) Les HutchinsonSaturday, 31 July 2004
Redneck ACT at Googong rued by many (225 words)
So Canberra now has its own Srebrenica, at Googong Dam, where hundreds of kangaroo families were handed over to the bullies with guns and callously executed.
One would have hoped that the Canberrans might have realised that we humans are just animals too, no delusory special creation with imagined dominion.
That these kangaroos, refugees from the drought and from a land degraded by 120 or so years of grazing by cattle and sheep, might have received a sympathetic reception, as fellow animals in need, and as a tourist boon for the Nation's Capital.
These fellow animals, more Aussie than we are, with a history in this Land going back millions of years, might have been treated as we ourselves would like to be treated.
Bales of Lucerne hay might even have been put out to give them a hand through this dry, cold, grassless winter. Instead we had genocidal species cleansing by murder.
Unfortunately the people of Canberra showed themselves to be as half-educated, self-obsessed and self-serving, and as redneck as any in this Land of the Fair Go, what a sick joke.
Whenever I come to Canberra in the future, my visit will be spoiled by memories of the slaughter of my kangaroo brothers and sisters at Googong Dam of July 2004.
Can the human animals of the ACT do something to redeem themselves?

To Pam Berriman - Have you thought of slowing down Just Drive CarefullySunday, 1 August 2004
Speed kills and if you can't stop quickly you're driving too fast. I had an idiot (male driver) who supposed to give way to me, stop half way across an intersection only today and had to swerve suddenly to avoid a collision. Thankfully, I was driving at a speed where I could control the car, applied the brakes and managed to avoid an accident. Perhaps I should have pulled out a shotgun and killed him instead? That's what your suggesting we do with kangaroos? There are still more accidents caused on the roads between humans(where there are no kangaroos involved) and that seems to be OK? It's only when a kangaroo is on the scene that it becomes a major trauma for you.

From me:Pam Berriman, if you honestly believe that roos all die instantaneously during a cull, then you have swallowed Stanhope's line hook, line and sinker. 100,000 roos are killed inhumanely every year, even according to the RSPCA, who are pretty weak on this issue. This figure does not count the many roos who are shot inhumanely and are simply left in the wild to avoid financial penalty. There is nothing humane about Australia's kangaroo culling programme. The conditions under which culling happens (specifically, the shooters shoot from a distance and often at night)means that shooters often miss their target (the head). When they approach the squirming roo with the bullet in its body, often the neck, often the roos are then hauled up onto the truck using a big metal hook hoiked into the roo's flesh, before they are finally put out of their misery.
Often the roos that are shot are carrying joeys. The joey is then clubbed to death with a whack to the head if the cullers find the joey. Unfortunately, often the mother ejects the joey from her pouch out of stress of being shot. The joey then jumps out into the wild and is left to fend for itself.

Lauren, you ask what do the kangaroos really do. I quite frankly don't know how to answer that if you don't know already. There is a school of thought that says that not everything in this world has to have some financial value to be of value. There is even one that suggests that not everything has to be of value to homo sapiens for it to be of value.
Why does it matter if they are eating your lawns to you? I realise suburban areas are not all that safe, but I really can't find a whole lot of sympathy for you worrying about your precious manicured lawns and your lovely swimming pools.
As for you being put at risk, I have already suggested what I think, but perhaps I wasn't clear. I also drink from Canberra's water supply. If the water gets dirty, that's our tough luck.
You still seem stuck on this idea of numbers in the population. Roos are more than just numbers. They stress when you shoot them. They stress when you shoot their friends and family. They are living creatures lauren.
What I meant by humans having caused it was my original point that there was no problem until we came along. The problem partly stems from what bits of the world we feel we are entitled to keep all to ourselves.
But as you say, if the water and air is at risk, then why sit around doing nothing? So based on that, car users should theoretically be culled, should they? Can you explain to me what seems to be an inconsistency.

Roos, their purpose?? laurenMonday, 2 August 2004

Now who said I was worried about the "precious lawns"? And I don't have a pool. I was merely making up possible situations. It would seem to me that you skipped entirely over my main point of the SAFETY OF CHILDREN AND FAMILY PETS.
"As for you being put at risk, I have already suggested what I think, but perhaps I wasn't clear." –don't know what you are talking about. Sorry. Feel free to post again to me directly so I can find it and read your views.
And as far as the water supply goes, I think saying tough luck is a bit immature... I mean really. Water is essential for life. Let me put it to you this way, this is how I see it. Say if I had $100 dollars (which is also essential for living-now-a-days), but there was some dude who kept mugging me every week and taking $20 of me. Would I just say oh well. That's just tough luck for me...no I wouldn't just say that and I doubt you would either, im sure you'd try and do something about it.
We can do stuff about this, why should it have to be a problem?!? We don't have to have dirty water. We can have safe clean water for our children and ourselves.
Yes they stress (im sure they would stress when friends and family are taken down, but I don't know how similar to humans they are with emotion and all. Its more an instinct they live from) I know they aren't just numbers but I have to say they aren't exactly human either...
Humans caused it?? So where should we go then? I mean if you think about it, if humans had been like, oh geez there is another form of life here, better go somewhere else...would we be this far today? No. I know it's unfair to kill of kangaroos, but its something we need to do to survive. In the long run I don't believe that the culling will affect the roos numbers, eg they aren't likely to become extinct, so I personally have no huge issue with it.
Ok, sure, but its not a huge problem. Factories produce more smoke and pollution than cars.. why not bring them down too!?! I'm not going to bother answering that question because it's a silly question and impossible to answer. (Not being rude, but u cant answer it) I mean where would we stop?
The world is far from perfect, and unfortunately it's a world of give and take!

No more culling - trying Birth Control Gary E. KaminskiMonday, 2 August 2004
This kangaroo culling has been revolting, however, I do think since the situation is out of control, because of human interference, that at this time there is no choice.

However, that is no excuse for the future. Here in this country we are examining ways of darting female deer with a form of birth control that can in some cases even sterilize the female. Surely this is a more humane approach.

Here is one article I found on the subject:

http://magazine.audubon.org/webstories/deer_birth_control.html
Birth Control for Deer?


To Lauren......on Roos and their purpose MaryMonday, 2 August 2004

You seem to fail to recognise the fact that the water from Googong is fully treated. There was/no risk of contamination to the water by kangaroos. The
ACT Government just lied to justify their decision and it would be appropriate for their actions will to be subject to scrutiny by the ACT Legislative Assembly.

It's so easy for politicians to get the public to align with their decision by using 'fear' tactics. Howard used it to justify the War on Iraq and Hitler used it make people fear the Jews.

It's the same tactic but this time used by Stanhope to justify the cull of kangaroos. It's not a case of kangaroos or your children (that's rubbish). Kangaroos pose no threat to your children or the water supply to Canberra.

As far as safety on the roads is concerned, people should just slow down. There is a great risk of being killed in an accident with another car (or a 4 wheel drive with a bull bar) than there is with kangaroos.

Don't blame them for everything. It might be convenient but it's not fair.

The save 'critical water supplies' issue was used by Stanhope in this instance as well. Animal Hating Greenies need to be controlled.Tuesday, 3 August 2004

"Mr Stanhope's remarks regarding the essential need to protect the natural values of Namadgi National Park threatened by feral horses sets a strong example for the Carr Government," said Andrew Cox, Executive Officer of National Parks Association of NSW.

"The Chief Minister's decision is the right one because to do otherwise would allow horses to damage critical water supplies and wilderness areas," said Mr Cox.

It's ironic that Mr Stanhopes answer to saving water supplies and wilderness is destroying animals and not on bush-fire control. Bush-fires do far more damage to the wilderness, wildlife and as he found out not that long ago Canberras main water supply at Bendora Dam.

Killing animals won't solve the ongoing and greater risks posed by bushfires and salinity.

Why don't they get that right first and focus on the important issues. Leave the poor helpless animals be. They actually do so little damage and in fact do some good by keeping undergrowth and grass down (which acts as kindling)

http://www.npansw.org.au/web/news/media/030611_Environment_Groups_Welcome_Chief_Ministers_Stand_on_Feral_Horses.htm

Lauren, firstly a brief response from me:
>And as far as the water supply goes, I think saying tough luck is a bit immature... <
You may well do, but I don't understand why. Try sticking to the argumentation, rather than the simplistic insults, so that you might convince me. I consider it immature for a Canberran to use the word "dude", but let's move on. Yes the water might get dirty at times. I have been to towns in France where the tap water has to be boiled all the time and my friends there have an entire garage full of Evian. Bourgeans are not nearly as well off as Canberrans are but they cop the consequences of their lifestyle.

>. Say if I had $100 dollars (which is also essential for living-now-a-days), but there was some dude who kept mugging me every week and taking $20 of me. Would I just say oh well. That's just tough luck for me...no I wouldn't just say that and I doubt you would either, im sure you'd try and do something about it.<

I certainly wouldn't kill the feller either.

>We can have safe clean water for our children and ourselves.<

May I briefly say that as a student of rhetoric that I admire your constant appeal to "the children". It is admirably manipulative. I mean that sincerely.

>Yes they stress (im sure they would stress when friends and family are taken down, but I don't know how similar to humans they are with emotion and all.<

I agree, you don't know. You have simply swallowed what your high school science teacher taught you without ever questioning it.

>) I know they aren't just numbers but I have to say they aren't exactly human either...<

You know, it's less than 100 years since we used to say that about Aborigines.

>would we be this far today? <
This far? What, progressed enough that we are killing kangaroos on mass? Hooray for us!

>I know it's unfair to kill of kangaroos<

I wish you'd stop pretending you care.

>.. why not bring them down too!?! I'm not going to bother answering that question because it's a silly question and impossible to answer. <

I didn't actually suggest it. What I pointed out was your hypocrisy in not calling for this. As someone else put it, you're an animal-hating greeny. I agree with you that you seem to find it impossible to answer, but that doesn't make it silly. That just makes it a tough question. I wouldn't suggest leaving the National Capital, I'd suggest drastically changing your way of life. How you do this is a matter of conjecture that I won't enter into because I don't want to cloud the issue.

However, I see that many people here have already responded to you more eloquently than I could ever hope to. Here I include the bits I deem most eloquent in the hope you will address them:
So Canberra now has its own Srebrenica, at Googong Dam, where hundreds of kangaroo families were handed over to the bullies with guns and callously executed.
One would have hoped that the Canberrans might have realised that we humans are just animals too, no delusory special creation with imagined dominion.
Bales of Lucerne hay might even have been put out to give them a hand through this dry, cold, grassless winter. Instead we had genocidal species cleansing by murder.
Unfortunately the people of Canberra showed themselves to be as half-educated, self-obsessed and self-serving, and as redneck as any in this Land of the Fair Go, what a sick joke.
There was/no risk of contamination to the water by kangaroos. The ACT Government just lied to justify their decision and it would be appropriate for their actions will to be subject to scrutiny by the ACT Legislative Assembly. Kangaroos pose no threat to your children or the water supply to Canberra.

Yes! Actually, kangaroos are very compatible with the Austrralian environment because they are soft-footed creatures which is the best way of avoiding erosion and preventing other detrimental effects to the soil. If there are "too many" kangaroos, then it is because the invasion of kangaroo territories by humans and the human degradation of kangaroo feed (grass) results in the kangaroos having to look elsewhere for their food and somewhere to 'live'. Humans have a lot to answer for. But of course, they (white humans) are always ready - too ready - to blame the creatures (kangaroos, aborigines etc) that were living in the area in a peaceful and environmentally-friendly way for the 'problem'. "If it's in our (white human's) way, get rid of it" seems to be the white human's credo.